Buenas tardes,
Este foro será utilizado para contestar preguntas o dudas que se generen durante la sesión. (en español)
Son bienvenidos de participar y preguntar lo que se les ocurra.
Saludos!
Hello everybody,
Here you can share your thoughts and questions about our session. You are welcome to participate and ask anything you want. (also in English)
Regards!
Hei (en fines) !
Hernan, really nice presentation from you at the site , I liked especially your advise in the beginning to Think before doing. Good luck with the SIMs, I am waiting eagerly to see the actual SIM in the end of the week.
Saludos,
Vesa
Hernán y equipo: buenas tardes. No termino de entender el mecanismo de participación. Es mi ignorancia en estas cosas de la tecnología. Uds. presentan en línea el tema a partir de las 19:15UTC? Es así?
Muchas gracias en contestarme, Marines. Saludos al equipo.
Oscar.
Buenos días Hernán, Hemos empezado descargando la agenda y el inicio, es correcto el procedimiento?, la duda seria sobre el diseño en los simuladores, debemos esperar las consignas entiendo?. Muchas gracias.
Ya se encuentra en la web el link al formulario para enviar las respuestas del simulador.
I have just upload a link to fill in with your answers. (simulator questions)
Saludos.
Regards.
Hernan,
this simulator exercise was intense... I used one hour to work on the case, and it is one of the best self-paced learning modules I have gone through for a long time. Especially after I learnt to use Stop button... :)
You have made the resource (your Conceptual model on Zonda wind) available. But more than just offering a resource to read, you do not leave it there, but convert the resource to an active Learning session. The resource becomes a fundamental part and story for your a simulation and analysis case.
I felt it was a good idea to give the "ideal" image of a conceptual model always in the introduction, and then compare it with the real case challenge.
Needless to say, the programming of this simulator exercise must have taken hours and hours for you. Kudos to you all.
Vesa
Hello, Hernan,
I fully agree with Vesa's comment!
To introduse with all material on unusual for me Zonda phenomena-it was a big challenge for me. Meanwhile, the process involved me and I was glad to work on it and to answer the simulator questions. There are no mountains in Lithuania, and the cyclone rotation in South America is extraordinary for me as well. So, it took much time to analyse the situation, but tools are friendly to use and I found not too much difficulties. In contrary, it was interesting and THANK you for refreshing our brains:)
Only a few notes-I could't find WV images, dust microphysics and models forecasts.
I added a few pictures from simulators we have at our Service. We have 2 cases(severe storm 06-08-2012 and prolonged heavy rain, 16/21-09-2013) analyzed and prepared for students or young specialists. But we need to improve them very much. And now can see the way, how:))Thank you for sharing your experience, dear southern colleagues!
Izolda
Izolda, Hernan,
a nice coincidence to see both in Lithuanian and in Argentina SIM screens the same word Zonda/Zondas : )
En Calmet14, el mundo no parece tan grande!!
In Calmet14, the world does not seem so big!!
Lithuanian word "Zondas" means "sounding". So , it is very close to your "high sky", Marines:)
Hi Hernan,
Do to traveling and being involved in a training course, and am now just catching up with CALMet sessions and was just able to go through your simulation (without answering all the questions). Wow! Thanks for making this available in CALMet.
You and your team really deserve some applause for creating this asynchronous approach to a simulation. The tools are simple and intuitive (and flexible), and the way of capturing the responses of students via the Google forms is really clever. The simulation is designed such that it can be done on any timeframe, and feedback can be provided by the instructor either individually or as a group (if a deadline is given). And as Vesa says, I think the presentation of the conceptual model up front is a nice orientation such that even me, a non-meteorologist, could follow the lesson.
I was just responding to Roger/Bodo today about the Brain Rule #12: Exploration, and mentioning that simulations and case studies can be done online just as much as in the classroom, and your example is perfect: https://classroom.eumetsat.int/pluginfile.php/12950/mod_resource/content/6/index.html for anyone that missed it.
When I was at COMET, we developed many instructional case studies for asynchronous online learning, but due to the COMET situation, I was not able to be involved in any that used remote instructor feedback and discussion to enhance the learning. We certainly provided feedback, but had to anticipate the difficulties students would have in the case. They were effective self-directed tools, but I really like how you have applied the same to an instructor-guided situation.
I hope you will be inspired to continue trying such approaches, because I am sure we can all learn from them.
Patrick
Hernan, Marines et al,
la versión española de CM4SH Zonda es impresionante. Felicitaciones.
Hi All,
No questions for now, just joined in... - only a comment on a nice and colorful introduction, compliments for that. Do not know much particularly about Zonda so looking forward to learn and see more.
And unfortunately I can not write above stated in Spanish - perdona me J
Nice job so far...
Good weekend to all!
Ivan
A merging of themes: conceptual models, simulators, online learning, and research to operations.
I’ll start in this forum because the example is in the simulator. For me living to the east of another mountain range where we experience “chinooks” (the relatively warmer dry wind blowing down the east slopes of the Rocky Mountains) this topic is relevant and poses many challenges. It is a challenge for aviation as well as ground transportation and other everyday outdoor activities when there is a strong wind event. This type of event can be variable: high winds in Boulder and Denver and lower winds 80 km to the north in Fort Collins.
First, I’ll touch on what others have recently mentioned: Yes, there are many training resources out there! So much information that it is hard for a forecaster (with limited time for training) to sort through and find what suites their particular need. It is to our advantage as trainers to go through other training to see how the topic has been approached and taught and find parts that resonate with the topic at hand and utilize them ie tailor the training to “our” needs. What I hear most from participants is – “I’d like an example/case for my region.” I think what this really means is that the participant already recognizes that this is an ideal model and it works that way for your region, what does it look like for my region? Does it work the same way or can there be subtle differences that might have a big impact? Very obvious examples of where the conceptual model can be more significantly different include the northern hemisphere vs southern hemisphere – as demonstrated here.
I’ll also say congratulations on what you have done with your conceptual models project and further work on the simulation because it truly is a large effort! And I’ll be the first to admit that going from in person training where you can look at facial and body responses and adjust the explanation seems quicker and easier than doing at a distance.
I am bringing up the next point to (possibly?) help for interpretation with materials. It relates to a theme of research to operations which we have come across: do units matter? As I get older, my vision gets poorer and so I am constantly zooming in on images and text to (literally) see them better. In module 3, when I look at the conceptual models with the shaded model fields to the right, it makes sense. When I zoom in to c) vertical velocity and really look at the image, I get confused. I’m surprised to see negative values on the upwind side because I’m thinking in units of vertical velocity of m/s. When I look at the loop, I see that it is in Pa/s. My questions are: Why is Pa/s used? Is it what comes out of the model? Is it what the forecasters in Argentina are used to looking at? Is it what the Researchers in Argentina use? The point is: sometimes we have to take a step back and see if there is a better unit to present the material in so that the concept is more meaningful or fewer errors are made in deciphering it when using it in real-time. Perhaps this is also a small example of inter-disciplinary interaction? (Education and Meteorology!)
-Bernie
Thank you Bernie, excellent points. We are working on bridging science and research to operational meteorology, a key role of the training department at SMN ( met office).
CM4SH involved a very interesting and thorough process, begining by literature review ( we revised theory and papers). Comparisons, discussions, choosing parameters, units visualisations, we followed Milestones step by step.
For the vertical crossections , to be consistent with all the fields we used vertical velocity omega (Pa/s) instead of w ( m/s). The forecasters that have tried it seemed ok with it (in the training phase)but we need to have more feedback from forecasters if they get to use it operationally.
Now that we have something to show - our conceptual model on the SIM- we can work together with the forecasters.Communication is essential . Our first experience is encouraging: he SIM makes it very attractive to go into the conceptual model. Forecasters found it useful and discussions were started spontaneously. It helps a lot to build a common language.
(By the way , in a late version you can zoom in the figure to be able to read)
One big issue for mesoscale phenomena is the model resolution, as Juan Ruiz( revisor) pointed out and he will help us with that,
A lot of work has to be done to get to operational application ( involving other issues.) But now we can actually see what can be done.
Saludos,
Marinés
Gracias Bernie por tu comentario, usamos omega en vez de w para la velocidad vertical para ser consistente con los demás campos. Los pronosticadores no tuvieron problema con esto en la fase de entrenamiento. Pero tendríamos que ver para la fase operacional.
Hacer un puente entre la ciencia y la meteorología operativa es una necesidad de la cual se esta ocupando el departamento de capacitación. El revisor Juan Ruiz nos comentó sobre el análisis con un modelo de mayor resolución. la comunicación es esencial.Con el SIM se logra acercar los modelos conceptuales a los pronosticadores de manera práctica. Habrá que trabajar mucho para llegar a la fase operativa.
Saludos
Marinés